”For a few years now, one of your preoccupations has been executive coaching, even though on the market you are known for your company’s training activity. How did your relationship with coaching start? Where did you train and why did you make this choice?
My relationship with coaching started somehow unexpectedly, as it happened many times in other situations in my life: clients of mine, foreigners, proposed that I do that for them. I hesitated, then I did it and I succeeded. So in a way, I could say that this activity came to me.
I had the chance, throughout the years, to have foreign clients who believed in me, who saw something in me that I could not always see. I attended an Executive Master in Coaching and Consulting at Insead. It is one of the best business schools in the world, in the same league with Harvard or London Business School. I studied in France for two years and I had exceptional teachers, people who do research, who write books, famous psychoanalysts from different parts of the world.
I chose Insead because I still believe in differentiation. Maybe Michael Porter’s strategic models are considered outdated. I believe in some of his concepts: differentiation is one of them.
In a market where being a coach is fashionable, doing coaching (as a client) does not yet represent a priority or a necessity, I did not see any other way. In addition, I believe, in order to guide others, I have to educate myself in this respect, not just do some courses for a few days.
My professional background is that of a teacher. I always considered that to show the way to those I work with, it is necessary to be one step ahead of them, to have learned more, to be informed, to have been through some experiences, to have understood myself more profoundly before I understood them. I do not want to seem arrogant, it is not about this, but about a responsibility that I take in my side of the relationship.
What does executive coaching add?
Working with executive fascinates me. Maybe because that is how I started, because I had, throughout time, the luck to meet some foreign executives who inspired me, who helped me, supported me, and made me enjoy working in this industry. In addition, the fact that I myself have to run a company, that I wore many hats along the way, makes me understand what people in my position come up against.
Executive coaching comes with another type of responsibility, approach, with the need for me to be prepared more, in more domains, to know how to see beyond the impressive business card of an individual.
Recently you have become the VP Mentoring for the international board of Professional Women’s Network. What is your objective?
Yes, I was chosen this year. I have a few objectives for this association. One of them is to create a network of international executive mentors to work with mentees from different countries and to support the leadership based on gender equality.
Another one is reverse mentoring. There are a few countries that have implemented this concept. I would like, beyond creating a plan and developing the whole process, to implement it in more City Networks.
Do you have a preference between coaching and training?
No, I like both. However, I know my limits and I know what type of people I could mentor and where I should leave the place to someone else.
I believe that not everybody is open towards mentoring, or maybe we have periods when we are and others when we think that we know everything better than everyone else.
There are also people who avoid working with a mentor, a coach. We have been taught to take care of ourselves, we have this need to show ourselves that we can, that we carry a lot, and avoid talking about ourselves, many times. However, I do not think this is a good strategy. In the long run, we could damage our own being.
From my point of view, both coaching and mentoring are in sync with what I planned 25 years ago: ‘to make a change in people’s life’. I took care of myself, of course, along the process.
What are the results that a manager expects from an executive coach?
Most of them want to see immediate results, want you to come up with something and help them think differently thanks to your questions, to find solutions, to help them see things from other perspectives.
I noticed that, many times, my clients also want to have a discussion partner in me, who understands their business, their unrest, who know how to ask questions and, very importantly, what to do with the answers.
What about mentoring?
People’s expectations are more diverse here. Some expect the mentor to help them make some connections, to recommend them to other people. Others think that the mentor can guide you, can share from their experience, however, the responsibility for decisions lies with each individual, not with the mentor. No one can take your place; it is important for everyone to take what they need from the interaction with the mentor and then to make their own decisions.
What is the biggest obstacle in the way of a successful coaching process?
I would say the degree of openness, of flexibility, that the coachee has. Openness comes when you want to work with yourself when you accept that there can be something different about you when you trust the coach when you are willing to take your own being into your own hands, the good and the bad. That means that you accept, in some instances, that you are your own harshest critic; to acknowledge that you treat yourself as if you were your own enemy; that the profound sensation of unlove made its mark on your relationships at the office; that your deepest fears will not let you relax and be more efficient. These are just a few examples; however, for a chance to take place and be sustainable, it is necessary to work more profoundly, to accept that, while it is not easy, there truly is a better version of us. What is important is to want to take it out of the shadows. Many times, however, we are afraid of our bright side.
Is there a type of personality that has better changing abilities than other people?
There are theories according to which people do not fundamentally change. I believe that who we are from the bottom of our being does not change. However, we adapt, we calibrate, recalibrate with the outside world; we learn, unlearn and relearn some behaviors.
A shy person will always have a degree of awkwardness, even if, in time, they will do some things on automatic pilot.
A person with a cloud over their head will always be in a rainy mood with thunder and fog, even if, from time to time, they laugh, make a joke, also notice the bright side of things.
I think that what matters is to be aware of our own shadow, to integrate it, to make constant efforts to dance with it, instead of fighting against it or locking it in a drawer. Then we will be more authentic, we will have a more friendly behavior, and the people around us, both from the office and home, will feel more comfortable around us, we will be able to build something with them.
Can we measure the effects of coaching? (If yes, how? What tools do you use?)
If you ask me about formulas, then the answer is: ‘I don’t have any’. If you ask me about different behaviors, different positioning, better performance, about reaching objectives, then the answer is yes. During the master’s degree at Insead, I had a colleague who requested, in the first modules, tools that he could use, to apply them to people. However, the teachers always explained that it is not about applying a certain tool. People are not like dough on which you apply a pattern, and voila, a croissant comes out. The school taught us, coaches, to be very well prepared, to have worked enormously with ourselves, and to use ourselves as a tool, to go to a coaching meeting ‘without memory or desire’, as Bjon said.
Going back to the effects of coaching, I think when you reached your goals, when a client got what they wanted (got promoted, changed behavior and received appreciation, validated by those around them, feel better about themselves, became the best version of themselves, regained their ‘wings’, self-confidence, the strength, similar to the Maleficent character) then we can say that the coaching process had an effect.
In one of the coaching schools in Romania, a lot of emphases is put on a powerful question – a question that can “open” the mind of the coachee to solve the situation. Do you believe in such a thing?
I believe there are powerful questions. I believe, at the same time, that we should know when to ask them. It so happened that I asked this type of question in a moment of vulnerability, and the question hurt. For some, it works more, for others less. I had situations when the shook-up was the tipping point; until then I was getting the field ready; beyond that point, however, the change occurred.
I also had situations when people cried. I know that crying can be therapeutic. However, crying is, for some, something intimate, delicate, that cannot withstand other gazes.
And so I agree with the powerful questions but within some limits. People, even though they seem strong, have such fragility! I prefer respecting the way they are, provoking them to reflect so much that, if necessary, they will cry at home, by themselves.
When I did it differently (and it happened), it seemed I violated the elegance and discretion of the relationships.
What is the “secret” ingredient in a coaching process?
Well, if it’s a secret? It is like the art of perfumes: everyone can combine different fragrances, but for something of quality to come out, something memorable, it needs the magic dust that the creator brings with them. I went to London to a place where you could create your own perfume, you know, the bespoke concept. Nothing magical results from the start, you will not create a Mitsouko perfume such as the one from the Guerlain fashion house. Art entails a lot of work. The same with coaching. Beyond the questions, the listening, the permanent work with oneself, the goal setting, the certain discipline, maybe each coach sprays a bit of their magical perfume, I hope. The result is the desired one, maybe surprisingly good or disappointing. It does not fall only on the coach, though. The most important person is the coachee. Then the environment, the context where the time is spent, at the office or at home.
What about mentoring?
Many of the ones mentioned above, I would say. It takes two to tango. It is essential to establish the responsibilities of each one, the environment where it takes place, the expectations, the connection between the two, both from the point of view of the experience, style and from the point of view of the ‘chemistry’, so that an environment of psychological safety and trust can exist. I would say there is a secret ingredient. The clarity of roles and expectations helps a lot.
How do you develop and continue to grow professionally?
I read quite a lot, both about coaching, mentoring, and literature, business, psychology, sociology.
I listen daily to a few podcasts.
I go to events, to learn from related fields.
I have some intelligent people around, who know a lot, from different fields and combine them in unique ways, to create new scripts.
Those people fascinate me. One such person is my teacher from Insead, Manfred Kets de Vries, who I meet every time I travel to Paris and with whom I talk on the phone from time to time. It is important to have people around who can get you out of the ordinary, and plant ideas in our minds. I have around people much younger than me – I could say that it is a kind of reverse mentoring, even though we don’t talk about this, and nothing is formal. But my millennial colleagues help me not to become outdated (I hope I am not☺)
What plans do you have for the future (in coaching)?
I want to relaunch the Journey to Your Inner Self project. It is a kind of team coaching that takes place over the course of a journey to the Oracle in Delphi, where, it is written “Know yourself’. I believe a lot in knowing oneself as a first step in understanding others, in developing suitable leadership abilities for this century.
A lot of people ask me if I do not want to start a coaching school; I am still at the stage where I’m weighing this decision.
I want to make an impact in PWN Global, to launch the International Executive Mentoring project, and for it to be a success.
I have a role in AVE (The Association for Values in Education) as coordinator of coaches and I want it to be a success and for all of us to have an impact on the development of the 40 school headmasters in Romania, thus contributing to our vision, which is to bring Romania into the top 10 educational systems in Europe by 2035.”
via: Learning Network